mlah The “culture” that has evolved here isn’t conducive to sissies

March 7, 2007

Wicca

Filed under: Religion — mlah @ 7:09 am

Wicca

so i wrote a post a while back and made the assertion that “wicca” is not truly a religion.

every now and again i get comments on old posts. mainly on my piercings post, but i got one the other day on my wicca post.

by a witch

Witch

now. she claims to be a good witch. and not the kind that flys on a broom or has a big nose with warts. but she does offer to cast spells for a fee.

i’m maintaining my position.

wicca is not a religion. it is a cult.

what’s the difference? religion are inspired by the divine. look at the major religions. judaism, christianity, budhism, and hinduism. all have a prophet of sorts, or more than one. and the prophet was inspired by God. directly or indirectly.

and consider wicca.

wicca claims to be the religion of the druids. older than any of the previous. and maybe, just maybe, i could consider the faith of the druids a religion. but is wicca really the same thing that the druids practiced?

if you believe that, you believe the inquisition was minor. the burning of witches was not widespread. and that druids continued side by side with christian zealots bent on stamping them out. who were these practitioners?

i think the inquisition was effective. salem and other burnings were WAY overkill. ie, innocents were had as well.

should witches have been burned? i’m not going there in this post,

brief segue as i chat with my niece

ok, that was yesterday. back to my post.

and i’m just throwing some more claims out here.

wicca is not a religion. wicca is a Realist attempt by disgruntled women at seizing power in their own made up religion. they make it up, they give themselves the power.

this is still a movement by power hungry chicks pissed at christianity because the hioghest rank a female can have in the catholic church is “nun”.

think about how witcxhes are being portrayed in the modern media. think back to practical magic. single women, no men. didn’t need em.

look at charmed. three witches (4 after shannon dougherty died) who dispatch demons, oh wait, all of the demons are male by the way.

but this is tv, and not wicca. i’m sure there are male adherants (warlocks) to wicca. but are they relegated to “nun” status?

but my basic claim resides on the fact that i see no prophet for wicca. no grand poobah of spellcasting how was inspired or led by “God”. just individuals who were disenfranchised by other religions and made up their own.

wicca is false.

but i’m all for a bunch of chicks getting together and dancing around nekkid (clad only in sky?) out in the woods! i just wanna watch. i’m just saying!

19 Comments »

  1. huh? witches don’t exist, and neither does magic. I was under the impression that wicca was a religion based on the worship of nature. Is that not true? I say it’s bogus, but if some hippie finds peace with it then good for them. Enjoy hell, pagans.

    But charging money for “spells”? Nothing sets off my bullshit meter quite like it. On the other hand, if you’re dumb enough to fall for it, maybe you don’t deserve the money in the first place.

    Comment by medium john — March 7, 2007 @ 1:48 pm

  2. “what’s the difference? religion are inspired by the divine. look at the major religions. judaism, christianity, budhism, and hinduism. all have a prophet of sorts, or more than one. and the prophet was inspired by God. directly or indirectly.”
    Buddhism is not theistic. No claims of divinity. Where does that leave your dumb theory? Your definition of “cult” is wrong. It has nothing to do with whether a divinely-inspired prophet is involved. There really isn’t a meaningful way to distinguish “cults” from “religions”. Using “cult” is just shorthand for saying that you don’t like them.

    “i think the inquisition was effective.”
    Effective at what? Torturing and terrorizing and forcibly converting Jews, Muslims, Protestants, Greek Orthodox and practitioners of all sorts of native practices? I agree. In other words, they were fucking fuckheads.

    “power hungry chicks”
    Power over what or whom? Themselves, maybe, but nobody else– certainly not you. Nothing wrong with that.
    My last 2 gf’s were witches. They were cool. Chill out, dude.

    “i’m sure there are male adherants (warlocks) to wicca. but are they relegated to “nun” status?”
    No, they aren’t “relegated” to anything. It’s all very decentralized, so there isn’t anything to be “relegated” to. What, are you championing Warlocks Rights now over those meanie feminazi witches? Good luck with that, chief.

    “wicca is false.”
    You’re falser.

    Comment by Gus — March 9, 2007 @ 12:22 am

  3. And anyway, US service people can get access to Wiccan chaplains, and the US prison system also recognizes is as a religion, so you can take your disagreement up with them.
    It’s been so long since you’ve said anything worth arguing about, hooray!

    Comment by Gus — March 9, 2007 @ 1:49 am

  4. lo and behold! gus is citing the military as evidence of something correct!

    wait, he did it to the us govt too! the govt said there were wmd’s in iraq too gus, must be correct, right?

    maybe you’re advocating reforming our schools along military boot camps? comeon now, the military does it! must be right!

    problem is gus, our govt (and military, and i’m not so sure there IS a wiccan chaplain)is polluted with these nasty little contagions called liberals. we have to allow bullshit to occur from time to time in order to stop the braying.

    Comment by mlah — March 9, 2007 @ 1:00 pm

  5. “gus is citing the military as evidence of something correct!”
    No, just the Constitution itself, from which equal protection has flowed to petitioners in the military and in federal prisons. I just thought you might respond especially to the mil’s authority. Did you not enlist in order to uphold and protect the Constitution (wherein the freedom of religion is enshrined)? Or were you just there for the Catholic version?

    “the govt said there were wmd’s in iraq too gus, must be correct, right?”
    Some members of the Executive did say that, but that has no bearing on the decrees of the SCOTUS. What a dumbshit thing to say. The various parts of “government” have fucking OBVIOUSLY been right about many, many things as well as wrong about many, many things. Just because I think they’re right to treat Wicca as a legitimare religion doesn’t mean I have to believe everything they say about everything. You don’t have to, either– but you must first make a decent argument for it if you want anyone to take you seriously.

    “our govt (and military, and i’m not so sure there IS a wiccan chaplain)is polluted with these nasty little contagions called liberals.”
    I thought you had a libertarian streak, no? This issue doesn’t require liberals. Once upon a time, Catholics weren’t very popular around here either. Basic fairness requires that wiccans be afforded the same protections that allowed Catholics to grow unimpeded lo these many years.
    http://www.religioustolerance.org/wic_usbk.htm
    http://www.milpagan.org/

    Comment by Gus — March 9, 2007 @ 11:19 pm

  6. moron, you just cite the constitutions equal protection clause and the freedom of religion and conclude from that that wicca IS a religion? you need a class in logic. i have called into question the veracity of the claim that wicca is a religion. if wicca is a religion, then of course it gets equal protection.

    do i get to set up the temple of mlah? give myself tax free status as a practitioner and operator of temple of mlahitude? exactly where does bs divide and religion start? hey! you can convert and be a part of my new cult. 30% tithe! tax writeoff man! come on!

    wicca is a made up thing so witches could feel empowered and get tax breaks. they have no claim of a divinity, they have no claim to religion. they just repeat it often and loudly, and schmucks like you agree because you think you’ll get some. i hope it was worth your soul!

    while the catholics were unpopular, nobody doubted they were practicing a religion. and when the catholics were unpopular, wicca did not exist.

    stay on topic gus. is wicca or is wicca not a religion.

    strange how you dodged the issue of a wiccan chaplain. you claimed there were, i doubted you. no response? provide proof!

    Comment by mlah — March 10, 2007 @ 1:39 am

  7. what a vicious debate

    Comment by Kristen — March 10, 2007 @ 8:20 am

  8. over witchcraft, no less.

    Comment by medium john — March 10, 2007 @ 1:16 pm

  9. I am too late for the debate?

    ‘Witch Cults’ are just that………….Cults………

    Why bother to give these people the tme of day…………They’ll try to convince people of anything………religion they say?? Spare me.

    Comment by Peach — March 10, 2007 @ 10:52 pm

  10. “they have no claim of a divinity, they have no claim to religion.”
    What about the Buddhists, then?

    “do i get to set up the temple of mlah? give myself tax free status as a practitioner and operator of temple of mlahitude?”
    Actually, I think you can, with some difficulty. Scientology started out (in 1950) as a self-help book, had battles with the IRS, but is now considered legit for tax purposes:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology#Scientology_as_a_state-recognised_religion

    “exactly where does bs divide and religion start?”
    That’s a good question. I think all religions are bullshit, personally. But Wicca certainly seems to FUNCTION in the lives of its practitioners in the same way as any other religion. Whatever, dude, your opinion won’t stop anyone from their witchy ways. Why do you even care?

    “strange how you dodged the issue of a wiccan chaplain.”
    My link pointed to what the military chaplain’s handbook says about it.

    Comment by Gus — March 13, 2007 @ 2:01 am

  11. THE true new religion is man-made Global Climate Change.

    Wicca is merely a late-19th to 20th Century attempt to legitimize nekkid getherings of pagan carnal delight.

    Of course, if your only criteria is that something “seems to FUNCTION in the lives of its practitioners in the same way as any other religion” then you must include the Religions of Porn, Gambling, Drink, Drug, Overeating, Exercise, Self-Help (with sects such as AA), Television, Politics….you name it, every someone has something that FUNCTIONS in the same way as a religion. So must we legitimize as “religion” every such something??

    Comment by yup — March 13, 2007 @ 1:15 pm

  12. Yuppy: “So must we legitimize as “religion” every such something??”
    That’s only half of the argument, dingleberry. If its practitioners *also* go a long way towards making a case for it as a real religion (unlike your examples)– incl. a willingness to jump thru gov’t hoops, show its historical provenance, etc.– then they probably do deserve to be legitimized, even if only grudgingly (as I do all of them).

    And back to Wicca and divinity: they *do* invoke “the Goddess”, so I dunno why you said it doesn’t involve the divine.

    Mlah: “this is still a movement by power hungry chicks pissed at christianity because the hioghest rank a female can have in the catholic church is “nun”.”
    There are plenty of other Christian denominations that ordain women, if they wanted to go that route. It’s not all about Catholocism, you dirty little masturbator. That’s a venial sin, right? Do you confess after every time you crank off a batch? Every sperm is sacred, you know. Don’t spill that seed upon the ground, no, no no!

    Comment by gus — March 14, 2007 @ 5:25 am

  13. dirty little masturbator? stay on target gussie gus. is wicca the religion of the masturbators? i don’t know.

    as to me? i live in a tiny wooden shack with some plywood walls. we’ve all built ‘forts’ out of blankets for a small semlance of privacy, so no. as much as i hate to disappoint you, there is none of that over here.

    and fyi, i’m non denominational.

    so you’re all about that church of the flying spaghetti? just becaquse a lot of bloggers are running wit their joke?

    the wiccans invoke the goddess? which goddess. i told you it was chicks upset about being unable to obtain rank in christianity.

    wicca isn’t even a cult. it’s a tax dodging she-woman man haters club.

    Comment by mlah — March 14, 2007 @ 11:05 am

  14. “the goddess” is gaia, she who is mother earth, of course. from her worship grows the catechism of global climate change and the innate evil of mankind (as opposed ot wymenkind).

    so wicca is the religion, climate change is the message, and algore is the pope.

    Comment by yup — March 14, 2007 @ 3:06 pm

  15. Yuppers: Get it right, algore is not the Pope. He is the Goracle!!!

    Comment by rojoxia — March 16, 2007 @ 9:47 pm

  16. “the wiccans invoke the goddess? which goddess.”
    THE Goddess. Like God, just change the He to She and the His and Him to Her.

    “as much as i hate to disappoint you, there is none of that over here.”
    Ha! Good one. That’s what the Port-o-Potties are for, stupid!

    “so you’re all about that church of the flying spaghetti? just becaquse a lot of bloggers are running wit their joke?”
    Only when discussing Intelligent Design w/ kooky Christians. I think you’d like it: “The Pastafarian belief of heaven stresses two points. “A) It has beer volcanos as far as the eye can see & B) It has a stripper factory.”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster

    “wicca isn’t even a cult. it’s a tax dodging she-woman man haters club.”
    So you can provide us with documented proof of even just one (1) woman dodging taxes because of it, right? As to man-hating, the Goddess’s consort is the Horned God, whom they are quite fond of.

    Comment by gus — March 17, 2007 @ 7:15 am

  17. I’m sorry, but I got a good laugh out of this whole debate.

    However, the Christian Science point was a good one.

    Comment by Miachelle — April 3, 2007 @ 10:16 am

  18. I just found this crazy debate and found it interesting. Anyone can trash talk me all they want, that is fine with me. It is a free country.

    I associate myself with the wiccan religion. Yes, I call it a religion, because it is my belief and my faith. I was brought up Christian Science. Through my school years I felt the need to search for a new religion. I wanted something that I could beleive in. Something that would give me peace. I went to a Jewish Church, a Non-demoniational Church, a Catholic Church, and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Mormon). Through out my journey I prayed to God many times. It was during my own personal prayer that I found the most peace in my heart and in my soul. I prayed often about where I should go and if I should be baptised by any of these religions. I’d also like to point out that at these chruches I felt no pressure from any of them, and I also felt very welcome by all of them. Then one day I realised something. I didn’t beleive in the bible. The Bible gave me no peace. I could not put my faith in the Bible. Maybe the Bible is the word of God, but a man wrote it down. Man is faliable. Man makes mistakes. Man has temptation. I cannot put my faith in something man made. The other thing about it is that it was written so long ago who knows how accurate it really is? And what about the apocraphy? Who decided to just throw those away? I respect all religions. But I can’t put my faith in something that feels so perfected. And then I discovered wicca.

    I can have my relationship with God/Goddess/Spirit without a book telling me what I can already feel in my soul and my heart. Besides, most religions are so similar maybe all God really wants is for His creations to want to be good. Who am I to judge you and your beliefes? Who are you to judge mine? You are my equal. Only God can judge me. God loves me, just as He loves you. So, who cares?

    I beleive that when you beleive in something you give it strength. Our souls have an energy. We can connect to each other and to God. You can tell me I am going to hell. I can tell you that I don’t beleive in a hell to go to. Have you ever thought, maybe God just wants us all to learn how to get along? Maybe God just wants us to listen to our hearts. Why would we have so many religions on this planet if only one was true? Why can’t they all be true? People really just want the best for everybody right? Or are they just selfish and greedy? I don’t think God would want that at all. But who am I to say? I’m just a wiccan who appriciates the beauty in the world and cries with the pain. I stop to smell the roses, and I swim in the ocean to feel the sea. I’m only human.

    Comment by Karyn — October 7, 2007 @ 9:28 pm

  19. I’m male and not a warlock, that’s an old british term for an oath breaker, but I myself used to follow the wiccan path and though I no longer do I still don’t see it as strictly a female religion. I’ve known plenty of male wiccan in my time. I’m going to agree with Karyn pretty much 100% as she seems to be the MOST INFORMED person debating on this subject.
    One further tip bit. The only reason I’m not Wiccan any longer is that I believe in all religions being linked to the one supreme being (I don’t think GOD/DESS has a sex personally) and I think that our afterlife is simply determined by our actions and experiances in this life and possibly others.
    Trash talk me as well if you wish. As long as it makes you feel better, it doesn’t harm me in any way.

    Comment by Wolven Skye — October 26, 2007 @ 2:08 am

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